Helio wrote:Drilling GRE - In china the GRE is like drilled into you. They have more resource (illegally of course), so they have more practice questions and they study for this thing like no other
emperial wrote:Helio wrote:Drilling GRE - In china the GRE is like drilled into you. They have more resource (illegally of course), so they have more practice questions and they study for this thing like no other
good point. Chinese and Indians have access to fresher (Illegal) questions than others.
emperial wrote:Helio wrote:Drilling GRE - In china the GRE is like drilled into you. They have more resource (illegally of course), so they have more practice questions and they study for this thing like no other
good point. Chinese and Indians have access to fresher (Illegal) questions than others.
lallooprasad wrote:I personally don't think Indian and Chinese need to cheat to do well. Physics GRE is difficult but not THAT difficult. With practice, anyone can do well. I think US undergrad education might not be as good as European undergrad education but it's far better from Asian institutes because there is so much flexibility in US, e.g. you can major in two things at the same time, you can choose a minor, etc. Things like these are not common here in Asia (from what I know about India and China). In addition there are research opportunities at undergrad level. Again, that is something not common here.
Classes that are not physics, applied math, or electronics are a waste of time for preparing for physics GRE.
rohit wrote:fun fact fer all you dumb Americans to feel worse![]()
most indian students study Resnick- Halliday / Servay in the last 2 years of high school, and you dumb-asses doo it in college .
Please nobody be offended.
rohit wrote:nonick wrote:rohit wrote:fun fact fer all you dumb Americans to feel worse![]()
most indian students study Resnick- Halliday / Servay in the last 2 years of high school, and you dumb-asses doo it in college .
You call all the Americans dumb and dumb-asses, and then you say:Please nobody be offended.
Hmm, how about watching your tongue, young fellow. I think that with this attitude, you'd be better off if you stay in India.
Judging from your spelling and your grammar, I am not sure who is the dumb here.
And yes, it is true that the US high-school education in the sciences is generally much worse than that in the Asian countries, but that doesn't make Americans dumb. Being smart does not constitute only in knowing lots of random Physics formulas, but also in being able to think abstractly and having a knowledge about the world around you and how to be a good citizen.
Hard to believe somebody took me seriously! And whats wrong with my grammer and spelling??
![]()
"fer" = standard (American) slang fer "for"
"doo" - extra 'o' added for comic effect. You know, like Dr. Doolittle ..
btw, dont mean to brag, but my GRE verbal score is 750.
Please, please, nobody be offended.
gliese876d wrote:Classes that are not physics, applied math, or electronics are a waste of time for preparing for physics GRE.
Exactly, and in almost every US school I'm familiar with, physics majors have to take an awful lot of these sort of classes, and for the most part they are just a distracting waste of time. Engineering physics majors get out of a lot of these requirements, and also learn a lot more electronics and are arguably more prepared to do well on the PGRE at my school than regular physics majors.
rohit wrote:fun fact fer all you dumb Americans to feel worse![]()
most indian students study Resnick- Halliday / Servay in the last 2 years of high school, and you dumb-asses doo it in college .
Please nobody be offended.
rohit wrote:fine , i get it, Americans can call each other dimwits jokingly( see gliese876d's post above), but others cant call 'em dumb, jokingly.
nonick wrote:I believe the main reason why the international students score higher on the PGRE lies in the fact that only the best of them apply to the US. I believe that the best American students tend to score as high as the best Indian, Chinese, etc. students, however not only the best American students apply to grad schools.
quizivex wrote:nonick wrote:I believe the main reason why the international students score higher on the PGRE lies in the fact that only the best of them apply to the US. I believe that the best American students tend to score as high as the best Indian, Chinese, etc. students, however not only the best American students apply to grad schools.
That's a good point. Just looking at numbers, there are over 2 billion Chinese and Indians alone but only about 300M Americans. Combine that with Europeans/Russians/Canadians who make up most of the remainder of international applicants, Americans are outnumbered by ~10 to 1 in population (i.e. potential applicants).
But when you look at physics grad school statistics of how many domestic/international applications they receive annually, the ratio is much closer to 1:1 or 1:2. That's not a formal analysis, but it does make it plausible that the international applicants are more talented on average compared to their peers than the American applicants are compared to theirs. And assuming natural talent is uniform throughout the world, and knowing that the nations represented in the physics applicant pool do have secandary education at least as good as it is in the US, the international applicants will naturally score better on the GRE on average.
There is also one more thing - The fees for PGRE - when converted in Indian Rupee it comes around Rs. 7,500, which is much much more than what an average person in India earns for a month. Even graduates in India get a job that starts at around Rs. 5-6k per month. So, when we sign up to take PGRE, we know that we have to score well in it, otherwise our hard earned money will go waste..!!
Imperate wrote:There is also one more thing - The fees for PGRE - when converted in Indian Rupee it comes around Rs. 7,500, which is much much more than what an average person in India earns for a month. Even graduates in India get a job that starts at around Rs. 5-6k per month. So, when we sign up to take PGRE, we know that we have to score well in it, otherwise our hard earned money will go waste..!!
Wow, that is insane. How do you afford applications, theyre mostly $90 a pop for internationals which is 4,500 rupees according to xe.com, so you're paying almost a months wages per place you apply?? In europe $90 is probably a day and a half in a min wage job...crazy crazy
rohit wrote:Imperate wrote:
Quote:
There is also one more thing - The fees for PGRE - when converted in Indian Rupee it comes around Rs. 7,500, which is much much more than what an average person in India earns for a month. Even graduates in India get a job that starts at around Rs. 5-6k per month. So, when we sign up to take PGRE, we know that we have to score well in it, otherwise our hard earned money will go waste..!!
Wow, that is insane. How do you afford applications, theyre mostly $90 a pop for internationals which is 4,500 rupees according to xe.com, so you're paying almost a months wages per place you apply?? In europe $90 is probably a day and a half in a min wage job...crazy crazy
Well , the people who apply to the US are almost exclusively at the top 20% of the economic ladder. I would say the avg monthly salaries of these people's families is at least Rs. 20000. Of course India has extreme poverty, and it shows up on the averages.
The minimum qualification for a PhD in US is a MSc from India... and by the time we finish MSc in
India, we have already taken many graduate level courses like - Quantum Mechanics, Electrodynamics, General theory of relativity, Quantum Chromodynamics, etc...
coreycwgriffin wrote:My school doesn't teach courses in major portions of the test (Optics, StatMech, Quantum is NEXT semester), and the only background I had in them was my own reading, which required drive or initiative that a lot of other American students don't have these days.
I dont quite see this logicsecander2! wrote:The fact that people who can hardly even understand english are able to make a 990 proves that these resources have no effect whatsoever on exam scores.
cato88 wrote:I dont quite see this logicsecander2! wrote:The fact that people who can hardly even understand english are able to make a 990 proves that these resources have no effect whatsoever on exam scores.
secander2! wrote:
The fact that people who can hardly even understand english are able to make a 990 proves that these resources have no effect whatsoever on exam scores
secander2! wrote:The fact that people who can hardly even understand english are able to make a 990 proves that these resources have no effect whatsoever on exam scores.
Wow, this quote says it all. In fact, I remember hearing an admin at my ugrad school talking about Chinese students cheating on the general GRE. He said something along the lines of, "In their culture, memorizing all the questions and answers is simply how one prepares for an exam." I didn't believe him at first, but for bencpp to blatantly use the words "illegal" and "not cheating" in the same sentence, apparently it is true. garden must be disappointed.bencpp wrote:Using illegal resources, such as the problems offered by the former testers, is not cheating. Using such resources is for preparation...
quizivex wrote:I struggled to follow the meanings behind the past few posts, but now I agree with secander2!
secander2! wrote:The fact that people who can hardly even understand english are able to make a 990 proves that these resources have no effect whatsoever on exam scores.Wow, this quote says it all. In fact, I remember hearing an admin at my ugrad school talking about Chinese students cheating on the general GRE. He said something along the lines of, "In their culture, memorizing all the questions and answers is simply how one prepares for an exam." I didn't believe him at first, but for bencpp to blatantly use the words "illegal" and "not cheating" in the same sentence, apparently it is true. garden must be disappointed.bencpp wrote:Using illegal resources, such as the problems offered by the former testers, is not cheating. Using such resources is for preparation...
Now if someone finds a set of "practice problems" and doesn't realize they were official problems, you can argue it's not his fault. But in fact, a teacher at my high school got in big trouble for just that... he found a page of calc AP problems laying around. He assumed they were from one of the many previous released exams, and decided to use them in a mock AP exam he gives to his class each year. One student noticed later that year that his official test had some of the same problems on it, and he reported it to ETS. ETS got in a huge uproar and initiated a lawsuit against the teacher and the school, arguing that it took millions of dollars in resources to make those problems and now they can't use them anymore... It took a whole year to resolve, and he only ended up losing $10K, but he was quite depressed for that year. While what he did was innocent, and maybe it wasn't his fault, but legally, copywright infringement doesn't take "intent" into account.
Helio wrote:quizivex wrote:I struggled to follow the meanings behind the past few posts, but now I agree with secander2!
secander2! wrote:The fact that people who can hardly even understand english are able to make a 990 proves that these resources have no effect whatsoever on exam scores.Wow, this quote says it all. In fact, I remember hearing an admin at my ugrad school talking about Chinese students cheating on the general GRE. He said something along the lines of, "In their culture, memorizing all the questions and answers is simply how one prepares for an exam." I didn't believe him at first, but for bencpp to blatantly use the words "illegal" and "not cheating" in the same sentence, apparently it is true. garden must be disappointed.bencpp wrote:Using illegal resources, such as the problems offered by the former testers, is not cheating. Using such resources is for preparation...
Now if someone finds a set of "practice problems" and doesn't realize they were official problems, you can argue it's not his fault. But in fact, a teacher at my high school got in big trouble for just that... he found a page of calc AP problems laying around. He assumed they were from one of the many previous released exams, and decided to use them in a mock AP exam he gives to his class each year. One student noticed later that year that his official test had some of the same problems on it, and he reported it to ETS. ETS got in a huge uproar and initiated a lawsuit against the teacher and the school, arguing that it took millions of dollars in resources to make those problems and now they can't use them anymore... It took a whole year to resolve, and he only ended up losing $10K, but he was quite depressed for that year. While what he did was innocent, and maybe it wasn't his fault, but legally, copywright infringement doesn't take "intent" into account.
I am impressed that copyright infringement is no longer a crime according to some people
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