really bizarre gres

dada
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really bizarre gres

Postby dada » Sun Dec 26, 2010 2:00 am

so

i got in the general gre

math: 610
verbal: 650

and in my pgre i got a 680

this is making me really stressed out. i dont know why i bombed the quant gre. i did not bomb the pgre - i mean its not extremely exceptional but better than most domestic students. will the pgre suffice to show i do not suffer from dyscalcula?

bonus points: my motherlanguage is not english. i am an international student in a pretty decent american university.

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WhoaNonstop
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby WhoaNonstop » Sun Dec 26, 2010 2:04 am

dada wrote:i mean its not extremely exceptional but better than most domestic students.

i am an international student in a pretty decent american university.


How will they view your application? As an international student or a domestic student?

-Riley

dada
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby dada » Sun Dec 26, 2010 2:07 am

WhoaNonstop wrote:
dada wrote:i mean its not extremely exceptional but better than most domestic students.

i am an international student in a pretty decent american university.


How will they view your application? As an international student or a domestic student?

-Riley


from what i gathered it depends on the university. if i apply in-state they will not like me that much because in-state tuition rates. but i heard i am comparable to other domestics simply because they know my school and my professors. (a lot of internationals dont have this luxury so they have to churn out 990s)

twinb87
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby twinb87 » Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:54 am

Retake the General GRE. The quantitative score is too low. It should be at least 750+. I know this test is very annoying but I think a 610 on the quantitative will really hurt your application.

dada
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby dada » Sun Dec 26, 2010 12:35 pm

i know that =(. just after i got my quant score i subscribed to another test, but i wont be able to take it till jan 10 =((((

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WhoaNonstop
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby WhoaNonstop » Sun Dec 26, 2010 3:10 pm

Honestly, I think a 610 in the quantitative part is pretty low for anyone with the mathematical capabilities of a physics major. I do think it will reflect badly on your application. I also think it's quite awkward how your verbal greatly surpasses mine when English is my first language.

-Riley

axiomofchoice
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby axiomofchoice » Sun Dec 26, 2010 3:54 pm

I agree that you 610 Q is abnormally low for physics major. Especially considering that many top 20 schools seem to have average quantitative score of about 780.

WhoaNonstop wrote:I also think it's quite awkward how your verbal greatly surpasses mine when English is my first language.
-Riley


I scored in the 98 percentile in the verbal section, even though English is not my first (nor my second) language either. It goes to say how meaningless GRE is :D :D

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WhoaNonstop
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby WhoaNonstop » Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:59 pm

axiomofchoice wrote:I scored in the 98 percentile in the verbal section, even though English is not my first (nor my second) language either. It goes to say how meaningless GRE is :D :D


But you've been familiar with the English language for quite a while longer than international applicants (unless my assumption is bad here). =P I have been under the impression that anyone could do really well in Verbal through "memorizing" common words, even if they had no concept of the words.

-Riley

axiomofchoice
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby axiomofchoice » Sun Dec 26, 2010 5:54 pm

WhoaNonstop wrote:But you've been familiar with the English language for quite a while longer than international applicants (unless my assumption is bad here). =P I have been under the impression that anyone could do really well in Verbal through "memorizing" common words, even if they had no concept of the words.

-Riley


The verbal GRE is where I do think domestic students have a huge advantage over internationals since we more or less have to study for the SAT verbal. I think if you knows the Webster's dictionary inside out (which does not automatically means that you know a lots of English), you can do very well in the verbal GRE. But there are also the reading comprehension questions. I'm under the impressions that if you are good with vocabulary and have not hit a reading comprehension question by question 10, you are in good shape; but if you hit one before question 10 and did badly on that, you score won't be so high even if you know lots of vocabularies. It's a matter of luck, apparently.

I personally like reading comprehension questions much more since I can do them quickly and get almost all of them right in practice tests and the real test. Analogies, no so much; seriously, who use some of those words, a medieval monk? I think the reading comprehension questions are what actually test your English, not the analogies and sentence completion. But I'm partial. :wink:

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WhoaNonstop
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby WhoaNonstop » Sun Dec 26, 2010 7:28 pm

axiomofchoice wrote:The verbal GRE is where I do think domestic students have a huge advantage over internationals since we more or less have to study for the SAT verbal. I think if you knows the Webster's dictionary inside out (which does not automatically means that you know a lots of English), you can do very well in the verbal GRE. But there are also the reading comprehension questions. I'm under the impressions that if you are good with vocabulary and have not hit a reading comprehension question by question 10, you are in good shape; but if you hit one before question 10 and did badly on that, you score won't be so high even if you know lots of vocabularies. It's a matter of luck, apparently.

I personally like reading comprehension questions much more since I can do them quickly and get almost all of them right in practice tests and the real test. Analogies, no so much; seriously, who use some of those words, a medieval monk? I think the reading comprehension questions are what actually test your English, not the analogies and sentence completion. But I'm partial. :wink:


I'm just glad they don't put a huge weight on the Verbal. =P

-Riley

pqortic
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby pqortic » Mon Dec 27, 2010 11:53 am

WhoaNonstop wrote:
axiomofchoice wrote:The verbal GRE is where I do think domestic students have a huge advantage over internationals since we more or less have to study for the SAT verbal. I think if you knows the Webster's dictionary inside out (which does not automatically means that you know a lots of English), you can do very well in the verbal GRE. But there are also the reading comprehension questions. I'm under the impressions that if you are good with vocabulary and have not hit a reading comprehension question by question 10, you are in good shape; but if you hit one before question 10 and did badly on that, you score won't be so high even if you know lots of vocabularies. It's a matter of luck, apparently.

I personally like reading comprehension questions much more since I can do them quickly and get almost all of them right in practice tests and the real test. Analogies, no so much; seriously, who use some of those words, a medieval monk? I think the reading comprehension questions are what actually test your English, not the analogies and sentence completion. But I'm partial. :wink:


I'm just glad they don't put a huge weight on the Verbal. =P

-Riley


I wonder if they put any weight on at at all. if you apply to law school then you should have a very good verbal score and not so bad quantitative. but I cannot figure out how verbal score reflects any talent of a physicist.

axiomofchoice
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby axiomofchoice » Mon Dec 27, 2010 12:32 pm

pqortic wrote:but I cannot figure out how verbal score reflects any talent of a physicist.


Me neither. I was always surprised when some random/not-so-random source says that the verbal score is better indicator of the student's future success than the PGRE. I say BS.

But I'm glad about my verbal score simply because I have a backup plan in case I don't go to physics grad school: apply to grad school for English :lol:

admissionprof
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby admissionprof » Mon Dec 27, 2010 5:07 pm

axiomofchoice wrote:
pqortic wrote:but I cannot figure out how verbal score reflects any talent of a physicist.


Me neither. I was always surprised when some random/not-so-random source says that the verbal score is better indicator of the student's future success than the PGRE. I say BS.

But I'm glad about my verbal score simply because I have a backup plan in case I don't go to physics grad school: apply to grad school for English :lol:



Whoa---one of the most important characteristics of a physicist is the ability to teach, give talks and write papers. The verbal GRE is strongly correlated with the ability to do that. We don't look at it very carefully for domestic students, but a student with a low TOEFL and a low verbal GRE is not likely to get accepted.

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WhoaNonstop
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby WhoaNonstop » Mon Dec 27, 2010 5:56 pm

admissionprof wrote:Whoa---one of the most important characteristics of a physicist is the ability to teach, give talks and write papers. The verbal GRE is strongly correlated with the ability to do that. We don't look at it very carefully for domestic students, but a student with a low TOEFL and a low verbal GRE is not likely to get accepted.


I don't believe the Verbal GRE should be as strongly correlated. I would highly suggest looking at an applicant's statement for communication abilities over the Verbal GRE score. There are far too many international students that make my Verbal GRE score (430) look like a joke, yet I can guarantee that on average I can communicate much better in English than they can. No, I am not boasting, this is just common sense. I obviously can't communicate in any other language at all and I realize the difficulty international students have to go through in order to do so. Basing communication abilities on the Verbal GRE score alone is just plain ridiculous.

-Riley

pqortic
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby pqortic » Mon Dec 27, 2010 7:07 pm

admissionprof wrote:Whoa---one of the most important characteristics of a physicist is the ability to teach, give talks and write papers. The verbal GRE is strongly correlated with the ability to do that. We don't look at it very carefully for domestic students, but a student with a low TOEFL and a low verbal GRE is not likely to get accepted.

I strongly disagree with this and I think if you are in admission committee, you better reconsider your point of view. I don't know if you have ever taken or seen the test, but none of the words or phrases that appears in the test is used in daily conversation or in in/formal communication. I am an international student. I teach labs and I think Im doing a good job and now I am writing a paper and yet I had a terrible score in verbal section but a pretty decent toefl. acing the verbal gre is only a matter of memorizing a specific vocabulary which I think Chinese are very good at. because they have usually high scores and terrible accent.
as I said this test is designed by ETS for all majors. means that if a person wants to study English, Law, political science, literature .... in graduate school, they should have a good verbal score and that's because of the text they are going to read.

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WhoaNonstop
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby WhoaNonstop » Tue Dec 28, 2010 1:02 am

pqortic wrote:verbal gre is only a matter of memorizing a specific vocabulary


Some people naturally know this vocabulary and therefore will do well on the test.

However, I completely agree... Most international students aren't familiar with these words and attempt to memorize them. In the same light, I could do the same, but I don't see the relevance except showing my persistence in learning the English language to "impress" committees.

-Riley

axiomofchoice
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby axiomofchoice » Tue Dec 28, 2010 1:44 am

WhoaNonstop wrote:
pqortic wrote:verbal gre is only a matter of memorizing a specific vocabulary


Some people naturally know this vocabulary and therefore will do well on the test.


I disagree on the "some people" part. I would argue that very few people naturally know the vocabulary on the GRE. I consider myself a voracious reader (at least before college; at college I usually didn't find time during the semester), and I have little problem understanding any piece of difficult prose written in modern English (perhaps with the exception of Joyce's Ulyssses). I consistently know at least 90%+, if not 95%+, in all kinds of "wordlist" for the GRE. Yet the GRE verbal part unfailingly will give me esoteric words that I never in my life seen before, and can't help but wonder when are those words last used - six centuries ago? Not to mention that at one point in my life, I did spend some time memorizing words for the SAT.

In addition, in antonym and analogy questions those words are presented without any context. Seriously, when is the last time other than in the SAT/GRE/whatever-money-grabber-standardized-test do you need to know what a word means, without having any context? GRE verbal caters perfectly to those who just memorize the words. I'm glad that they are changing the test next year, although I know not whether for the worst or the better.

admissionprof wrote:Whoa---one of the most important characteristics of a physicist is the ability to teach, give talks and write papers. The verbal GRE is strongly correlated with the ability to do that.


Any evidences?

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WhoaNonstop
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby WhoaNonstop » Tue Dec 28, 2010 2:59 am

axiomofchoice wrote:I disagree on the "some people" part. I would argue that very few people


Right, I have no basis in saying some or very few. I just wanted it to be known that there is a limited number of people who can, especially in the field of physics.

-Riley

CarlBrannen
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby CarlBrannen » Tue Dec 28, 2010 5:43 am

Funny, axiomofchoice, I'm a native English speaker and read quite a lot, but the part of the practice verbal tests that screwed me were the reading comprehension tests. There was only one which I felt good about and did well on and that was because the test was on a concept I got my head around easily. (Something to do with astronomy and star categories. Funny that I'd deal with "who said it" better on a subject like that.)

liutian_min
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Re: really bizarre gres

Postby liutian_min » Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:15 pm

WhoaNonstop wrote:
pqortic wrote:verbal gre is only a matter of memorizing a specific vocabulary


Some people naturally know this vocabulary and therefore will do well on the test.

However, I completely agree... Most international students aren't familiar with these words and attempt to memorize them. In the same light, I could do the same, but I don't see the relevance except showing my persistence in learning the English language to "impress" committees.

-Riley


I also feel the verbal part shows how determined you are to get into a grad school since you have to work hard for a few weeks on something that is irrelevant to what you are interested in doing.




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